What's the best way to reduce piracy?

[Scotty]

Looks like the RIAA has decided to finally come round and say that maybe innovation as opposed to legislation is the proper way to reduce piracy:

http://torrentfreak.com/riaa-innovation-is-the-best-way-to-kill-piracy-120412/

While they are more than devious in their choice of words, it does bring up a very interesting topic.  What can be done to reduce piracy?  I personally think that marketing is not helping the ways it did back when online piracy was non-existent, and that today's marketing strategies haven't changed all that much in the broad scope.  What I find to be most effective is availability, cost, and hassle.  Two examples I have that will cover the above three topics are as follows.

Last week, I wanted to buy a music album.  I didn't know much about it, it wasn't even on the band's wiki page.  Come to find out that if I wanted to buy it, I would have to import it through Amazon.  By import, I mean I would have to have the physical compact disk arrive on my doorstep, all the way from Europe, there goes cost.  So naturally I go to check and see if I can get it for digital download through amazon.  No.  Google?  No.  iTunes?  No.  Can't find it anywhere for digital download, there goes availability.  I don't want to wait forever and a day to get the album, and I don't want to pay close to $20 for an album I'm not even sure I'll enjoy fully, so now I choose to download it illegally, and even that was a hassle trying to find it online.

Second example is games, and I don't even need to pick a specific game, just imagine DRM, or crippling bugs in games (Sims or Alice, Madness Returns) and hassle is out the window.  Not only those two things, but the basic quality of the game.  I have to purchase a game, then patch it (because you know, they can never release a fully updated game, there's always patches), and more often then not the flaws of the game are overwhelming, and yet somehow they feel that they can charge $60+ for these sub-par quality games.  I know that the prices haven't really gone up much over the past decade or two, because I can recall SNES games costing $50-$60 a game, but I'll be damned if I ever played a SNES game that had even half the bugs and flaws modern games have.  Quality goes down, price remains either steady or on the very slow increase, but hardly ever down.  That's why it would seem that Indie game development has skyrocketed;  People aren't afraid to shell out $10-$15 for games knowing that some small crew of folks take pride in their games, and maybe even feel sentimental about helping them out.  Of course serious indie developers are going to enjoy their work more than EA employees on the death march to completion of their games before all the developers are fired.

With regards to games, I find that Steam is the ultimate anti-piracy reducer.  They love indie games, they give out deals all the time, and make it incredibly quick and easy to get new games.  As far as music goes, I'm finding that I'm a huge fan of Google Play (Google Music), where I can easily search, find it, buy it, and immediately listen to it all online.  Prices may not be as good as Steams is for games, but it does cover every other aspect of why piracy is so common, or at least in my opinion.

I'm curious to hear what other people think needs to happen to reduce piracy.  Keep the senseless BS out (free is not an acceptable answer, we all know that).  I want to hear what innovations can be made to make pirating a thing of the past.

[ARTgames]

Keep the senseless BS out (free is not an acceptable answer, we all know that).

I disagree. I think some things being free is an acceptable answer. Not for a blanket fix for everything but i think it can work. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freemium And I also think cash market for free games can be good for free to play games. Depending on the game and how far they take it. What i'm basically saying is free can work in some places.

I want to hear what innovations can be made to make pirating a thing of the past.

Lol, and I only want the cure for cancer. You make it sound easy. But yes i understand you want a quality conversation. 

I don't have time to really expand on my other points for your topic. But I would like to get back to it later on.

[T-Rok]

I used to pirate everything. And then I found Steam. I honestly haven't pirated a game since. Then I bought ME3. NOW IM'A PIRATE FROM THAT RED LIGHT DISTRICT OF A COMPANY ALL DAY LONG.

What I'm saying is that Steam is the greatest idea to counter piracy I have ever seen. Music wise, well we won't go there.

[Chaos]

Well, I would pretty much agree with everything you just said.  Stop treating your customers like criminals, and stop making things so damn inconvenient, and stop being so god damn greedy.

For example, I love the Sims series.  I bought Sims 1, and every expansion for Sims 1 (and this is Sims we're talking about.  That's a lot of expansions!). 

I bought Sims 2, and I bought every expansion for Sims 2.  This is when they decided to start releasing 'Stuff Packs'.  I didn't buy those, because I'm not paying 20 dollars for a pack of items.  Rather, I bought them much later from a store near me that I love called Half-Price Books.  10 dollars was a much more reasonable price, imo. 

Then Sims 3 came out.  I bought Sims 3.  I was utterly disappointed by the lack of content present in this game.  Perhaps it was just because I was used to playing Sims 2, with all of its expansions?  I let it slide.  Then, when it came out (6 months later), I bought the first expansion, Sims 3 World Adventures.  This expansion added an interesting vacation-ish function to the game.  Big problem, though; it did NOTHING to provide new, MUCH needed content to the base game that already felt like a skeleton of the game.  Bigger problem; it was plagued with GAME CRIPPLING BUGS.  My save was corrupted to UNPLAYABILITY.  And, of course, they're still shilling out the 'Stuff Packs'.  Not to mention the 'Sims 3 Store', where they expect you to buy up all these items as DLC.  Is it any wonder that the game felt hollow?  All the content is being sold as DLC, because EA are greedy !@#$s.

I still play Sims 3.  I have pirated every expansion and Stuff Pack and even a rip of their entire Sims 3 Store catalogue.  Because !@#$ you, EA.  I loved the series, and then you had to !@#$ it all up.  You have no one to blame but yourself.  You want my god damn money?  Let's see you EARN IT.


Anyway, adding on to what you were saying about Steam, I recently made an account on GOG.com, and oh god, do I love it.  Good Old Games recently changed their name to just GOG, because apparently they are no longer simply selling old games, but appear to be moving towards selling newer released games as well, putting it in competition with Steam.  Only difference is, everything they sell is DRM-free, and it's all done through their website so I don't need an annoying app running in the background, and they all come with a bunch of bonus stuff, so it's like a dream come true for me.  :3

P.S.  Off-topic, but GOG.com has 32 Interplay games on sale 50% off this weekend.  http://www.gog.com/news/weekend_promo_interplay_blast
If anyone's been interested in playing Fallout 1 and 2, you can get 'em for 3 bucks each.  :3

[ARTgames]

.....I recently made an account on GOG.com, and oh god, do I love it.  Good Old Games recently changed their name to just GOG, because apparently they are no longer simply selling old games, but appear to be moving towards selling newer released games as well, putting it in competition with Steam.  Only difference is, everything they sell is DRM-free, and it's all done through their website so I don't need an annoying app running in the background, and they all come with a bunch of bonus stuff, so it's like a dream come true for me.  :3

Thank you for telling me about this. Now I need to try it!

Edit: I like their Mac theme even though most of the games i have seen are for Windows only.

[Chaos]

I don't know how MUCH they're going to be doing of new games, or how quickly, though; it's just what I've been hearing.  They do have Legend of Grimrock, which was released two days ago, though.  Still worth checking out, imo. :p

[ARTgames]

I like how they give you some free games. And that the games are DRM free. So if they die we still have are games.

[Chaos]

And that your purchases are attached to your account, so if your computer dies, you can log in and easily redownload your purchases. :3

[ARTgames]

Oh yes right! So all in all, this is the best way to reduce piracy. Now we need one for music, videos, books, etc.

[Jake]

Streamline purchases. get rid of DRM. Reduce prices.

[Scotty]

Streamline purchases. get rid of DRM. Reduce prices.

A lot of those are actively being incorporated, yet piracy still exists.  At what point is it enough?  The more I think about it, the more I'm starting the question whether ISP's upcoming "re-education" process is going to do the trick.  We have online services to purchase most online media, and some have some extremely competitive prices, and DRM... Well... That's one of those things that I'm convinced won't ever go away entirely no matter how much we plead, boycott, or lob proverbial molotov cocktails at the companies that incorporate it.  It certainly is on the decline, yet some companies still want to use it and think everything is going to be alright.

For those who caught that last part about ISP's actively targeting piracy, here's some more details.  I'm skeptical that any amount of price reduction, DRM removal, or ease of purchase is going to wipe out piracy, there has to be a fallback in place for those who just won't pay money period.  I understand the world is in a financial rut as of late, and that may very well attribute to online piracy, but even in a more ideal economy, this would still be a problem.  Do I think that it's right to have to have ISP crack-downs?  No, but sadly nothing short of free will stop piracy, and we all know that day will never come (hence my first comment about making everything free is not an acceptable answer).

[Jake]

Streamline purchases. get rid of DRM. Reduce prices.

A lot of those are actively being incorporated, yet piracy still exists.  At what point is it enough?  The more I think about it, the more I'm starting the question whether ISP's upcoming "re-education" process is going to do the trick.  We have online services to purchase most online media, and some have some extremely competitive prices, and DRM... Well... That's one of those things that I'm convinced won't ever go away entirely no matter how much we plead, boycott, or lob proverbial molotov cocktails at the companies that incorporate it.  It certainly is on the decline, yet some companies still want to use it and think everything is going to be alright.

For those who caught that last part about ISP's actively targeting piracy, here's some more details.  I'm skeptical that any amount of price reduction, DRM removal, or ease of purchase is going to wipe out piracy, there has to be a fallback in place for those who just won't pay money period.  I understand the world is in a financial rut as of late, and that may very well attribute to online piracy, but even in a more ideal economy, this would still be a problem.  Do I think that it's right to have to have ISP crack-downs?  No, but sadly nothing short of free will stop piracy, and we all know that day will never come (hence my first comment about making everything free is not an acceptable answer).

Stopping piracy and reducing piracy are two different things. There is no way to get rid of piracy, but there are a lot of ways to piss off consumers. Companies need to focus on creating better experiences for consumers, and in turn, it will help to reduce piracy. Alienating consumers with shitty DRM, high prices, and requiring them to download specific software are the main reasons people go to pirate. There are also people who pirate because they're cheap and want what they can't afford. These people will always pirate, no matter what businesses do.

I am against ISP crackdowns, because it requires them to spy on what we do online to figure out that we're doing something illegal, and that is none of their business, or anyone elses. If our government wants to get a warrant to search our online data usage, that's fine. But there is absolutely no reason for ISP's to be searching through our data usage history to see if we're up to no good. It's the same as if microsoft automatically recorded all files on our computer and alerted authorities if we had something illegal installed. There job is to supply a service, and if authorities want to seek legal action against one of us, they can go through the proper channels of doing so. The government is constantly trying to find new ways to spy on people, and im sick of it. We have a legal process for a reason.

[Scotty]

I'm mistaken in thinking piracy can be *stopped*.  That sort of delusion is similar to thinking we can stop physical theft, which is black & white enough to know it's un-achievable.  If physical theft was effectively wiped out, that would mean we would have to go to exorbitant lengths that would require substantial sacrifice, expense, and is completely unrealistic.  Such is the case for online piracy.  Unfortunately, that is what ISP's are trying to do, and you're right, it is uncalled for.  We don't have police in place at the entrance of every Wal-Mart and 7-Eleven to check our bags (and subsequently violate our 4th amendment in the United States) before we leave, and it's similar enough to warrant question as to why they feel the need to monitor our traffic as though we are criminals.  Given the link I posted previously, it's my understanding that they plan to target torrents, and while they have safeguards in place to appeal the accusations, I know that I personally have used torrents to download entirely legal software (linux distributions to royalty free music).  I can already see that they are going to blanket target people that torrent regardless of what the content is, not doing any research to see whether or not it is defined as piracy, and there's going to be a lot of wasted money and effort for the legitimate use of torrents.

So I guess my question to you (Jake), is can you elaborate on your previous quote of:

Streamline purchases. get rid of DRM. Reduce prices.

Sure, it's simple enough to understand, but what do you mean when you use words like "Streamline", and "Reduce prices"?  What do you view as feasible enough to stop you or others from pirating?  Are there current systems in place that do this?  Can they be improved upon?  Are they not doing enough?  What can they do better?  I'm genuinely curious to hear what it is you think they can do better.

[ARTgames]

I'm mistaken in thinking piracy can be *stopped*.  That sort of delusion is similar to thinking we can stop physical theft, which is black & white enough to know it's un-achievable.

0_o, what mindset where you in today?

I know your talking to (Jake) but i would like to add something in.

Streamline purchases. get rid of DRM. Reduce prices.

Sure, it's simple enough to understand, but what do you mean when you use words like "Streamline", and "Reduce prices"?  What do you view as feasible enough to stop you or others from pirating?  Are there current systems in place that do this?  Can they be improved upon?  Are they not doing enough?  What can they do better?  I'm genuinely curious to hear what it is you think they can do better.

Its hard to give those kinds specifics. I don't think any of us here have the business experience to give or a digital media company to test what parts of "Streamline", and "Reduce prices" work. And its hard for real business to do so also because messing up could mean going out of business. And what works for music may not work for video.

My bust guess of what your really asking is if we where starting up a new digital media company with some venture capital what are the details in which we could sell are product and feel that we are getting a far profit marge. I'm sure the reason you want to reduce piracy is to give something back to the creators/vendors. That's something that would be fun to think about and i think would answer you question.

[Jake]

I'm mistaken in thinking piracy can be *stopped*.  That sort of delusion is similar to thinking we can stop physical theft, which is black & white enough to know it's un-achievable.  If physical theft was effectively wiped out, that would mean we would have to go to exorbitant lengths that would require substantial sacrifice, expense, and is completely unrealistic.  Such is the case for online piracy.  Unfortunately, that is what ISP's are trying to do, and you're right, it is uncalled for.  We don't have police in place at the entrance of every Wal-Mart and 7-Eleven to check our bags (and subsequently violate our 4th amendment in the United States) before we leave, and it's similar enough to warrant question as to why they feel the need to monitor our traffic as though we are criminals.  Given the link I posted previously, it's my understanding that they plan to target torrents, and while they have safeguards in place to appeal the accusations, I know that I personally have used torrents to download entirely legal software (linux distributions to royalty free music).  I can already see that they are going to blanket target people that torrent regardless of what the content is, not doing any research to see whether or not it is defined as piracy, and there's going to be a lot of wasted money and effort for the legitimate use of torrents.

So I guess my question to you (Jake), is can you elaborate on your previous quote of:

Streamline purchases. get rid of DRM. Reduce prices.

Sure, it's simple enough to understand, but what do you mean when you use words like "Streamline", and "Reduce prices"?  What do you view as feasible enough to stop you or others from pirating?  Are there current systems in place that do this?  Can they be improved upon?  Are they not doing enough?  What can they do better?  I'm genuinely curious to hear what it is you think they can do better.

I'll give you a better reply when I get home from work, but I think at the most basic level, it means companies need to start trying to help the customer rather than milk them for all their worth. Steam is a huge example of that. When I buy a game and get a great discount, I feel like they're helping me out, not nickel and diming me. Download speeds are quick, games are competitively priced, and I can install them on multiple computers. I can tell they're trying to create a great experience for the consumer. Netflix is another great example of doing things right. Sure they jacked up the prices recently, but how can you beat unlimited streaming of movies and tv shows for like 8 dollars a month. It's way easier to go on netflix and watch a couple episodes of how I met your mother then it is to pirate them and have to wait.